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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 6:28 pm 
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mbrownn wrote:
The IRO is charging batteries at near 1 to 1 charging however it is producing a lot of magnetic energy which we do not use.


Any ideas of how to use this wasted magnetic energy, Mick? I have a few, we need to kick this around...

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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 1:37 am 
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JustAnElectrician wrote:
JustAnElectrician wrote:
It seems like from what I have read, that this will give you even more capacity on the dead battery after 5 or more charges. Is that correct?
YES, but it's best to use ONLY radiant charge thereafter.
It charges faster too. Lead acid, for example, should be down to 1.7V per cell then radiant charged. (10V on a 12V battery)



That 10v discharge level is ONLY recommended for the initial radiant charge. After that, follow normal discharge levels.
Just wanted to clarify that, so you do not drain to 10v every time.


PS: I blew up my silver cell, it was not getting hot at all until that last session I guess :oops:
I was not in the room when it happened.


JustAnElectrician,

What is a normal discharge level?

Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 2:10 am 
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The easiest way to use the magnetic energy is to power a motor with it. This is why we use motors, the rotational energy can be used to power some kind of generator. We can even combine a motor and generator in one unit.

The other way to do it is to surround our coils with recovery coils. Using the transformer effect we can wind extra coils around our coils.

Remember that the most concentrated magnetic field comes out of the ends of the coils, so this is a good place to mount a recovery coil.

Modern car ignition coils are designed to keep the magnetic radiation in the coil so it is harder to get to the magnetic fields. We would have to remove the metal case to get better access.

The disadvantage of this is that the energy gained is normal electricity and if used to charge the batteries we are charging with the back EMF, the positive effects of the chemistry change on the battery will be reduced or eliminated.

Now i have a question, what if we use this energy to charge capacitors to high voltage and pulse this into the battery, will this have the same effect on the battery as the back EMF?


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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 2:13 am 
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altrez wrote:
JustAnElectrician wrote:
JustAnElectrician wrote:
It seems like from what I have read, that this will give you even more capacity on the dead battery after 5 or more charges. Is that correct?
YES, but it's best to use ONLY radiant charge thereafter.
It charges faster too. Lead acid, for example, should be down to 1.7V per cell then radiant charged. (10V on a 12V battery)



That 10v discharge level is ONLY recommended for the initial radiant charge. After that, follow normal discharge levels.
Just wanted to clarify that, so you do not drain to 10v every time.


PS: I blew up my silver cell, it was not getting hot at all until that last session I guess :oops:
I was not in the room when it happened.


JustAnElectrician,

What is a normal discharge level?

Thanks!


lotsa guys say 12.4 volts but I would think 12.0 would be fine, Bedini and his followers like to keep it in the highest eff. range, so 12.4-ish. I think Mick says 12.4v

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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 2:40 am 
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mbrownn wrote:
The easiest way to use the magnetic energy is to power a motor with it. This is why we use motors, the rotational energy can be used to power some kind of generator. We can even combine a motor and generator in one unit.
This was my first idea, in fact, we have half of a tiny Newman motor right there...!

The other way to do it is to surround our coils with recovery coils. Using the transformer effect we can wind extra coils around our coils.
Kewl, that was another thought I had, but just the very basic thought... you get a transformer effect (likely) and it could draw more from the drive battery, but could clearly be worth it if overall charge efficiency goes up!

Remember that the most concentrated magnetic field comes out of the ends of the coils, so this is a good place to mount a recovery coil.
Did NOT know that, it would be like the Joule Thief arrangement

Modern car ignition coils are designed to keep the magnetic radiation in the coil so it is harder to get to the magnetic fields. We would have to remove the metal case to get better access.
that wrap-around laminated iron core for example...

The disadvantage of this is that the energy gained is normal electricity and if used to charge the batteries we are charging with the back EMF, the positive effects of the chemistry change on the battery will be reduced or eliminated.
well, I have an alternate IRO arrangement from that site
http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/
that gets the CEMF in the secondary coils, physically they are not "in-line" as you suggest, but they could be!


Now i have a question, what if we use this energy to charge capacitors to high voltage and pulse this into the battery, will this have the same effect on the battery as the back EMF?


There is at least one way drawn out already that causes the sharp gradient (similar to CEMF) in that link above*, uses cap's instead of coils, but we could always just pulse the cap output and dump into another coil. So many iterations are possible!
It's unlimited once you start using the wasted energy Mick. (sure you knew that!)


silly me the link was in chat box here it is again:
http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/
Look up Imhotep's stuff... it's in there somewhere.
The cap charger is a Ron Cole device I think, under one of the Bedini sections.

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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2009 2:24 am 
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I have finally got power back at my home here in Kentucky and I plan to get started soon! This thread has so much great information that I just wanted to thank you all once again.

I do have a question though :) Can a small 12v solar panel work as the source? And if so will it fully charge a 12v deep cycle battery?

And if that is the case can I connect another IRO to the target battery and repeat the procedure? So I could say string 8 or so battery's together in a line?

And then use that to power a 350 watt inverter? I know that some types of battery's can not charge and have a draw at the same time. What are the types of batters that can charge and have a power draw at the same time?

And can you over charge a battery with the IRO? Or could you simply just keep it all connected all the time?

And if you ran 8 of these in a roll and connected all the neon sources would you not have 8 times the radiant energy possible? And would that not be enough to run a small dc motor completely from radiant energy?

And if you could do that would this setup not basically provide an unlimited source of energy?

Thank you all so much :)


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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2009 9:06 pm 
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Where to start...
OK, I'll quote you:
altrez wrote:
I have finally got power back at my home here in KentuckyFINALLY! and I plan to get started soon! This thread has so much great information that I just wanted to thank you all once again.

I do have a question though :) Can a small 12v solar panel work as the source? And if so will it fully charge a 12v deep cycle battery?
YES an YES. Now, I had an overly discharged deep-cycle (new) that was on a
simple IRO for 8 days and it was not very well charged at all. Thinking of upgrading my
IRO (more coils or solid state) or going to the fan(s). It is too slow for normal cycling.


And if that is the case can I connect another IRO to the target battery and repeat the procedure? So I could say string 8 or so battery's together in a line?
Multiple IRO's on the same source would work, but not another one off the charge
battery. No one has yet (as we know) been able to charge and run (discharge)
simultaneously.


And then use that to power a 350 watt inverter? I know that some types of battery's can not charge and have a draw at the same time. What are the types of batters that can charge and have a power draw at the same time?
NONE that has been revealed. Bedini recommends rest time after radiant charging
as well. So we need to give it at least an hour before getting a reliable volt reading,
and JB suggests 24 hours before utilization.


And can you over charge a battery with the IRO? Or could you simply just keep it all connected all the time?
I Did! I popped a small silver cell, was not in the room when it happened. I would
get some type of computer control, or voltage sensitive circuit to meter it. I am also
working on a similar setup like you are, IMO solar would be a great prime mover, and
you could have a small primary battery bank for cloudy days. I have found small
economical latching relays that would switch these kinds of circuits with no draw on
the batt's in between switching times.


And if you ran 8 of these in a roll and connected all the neon sources would you not have 8 times the radiant energy possible? And would that not be enough to run a small dc motor completely from radiant energy?
IN A Row to me, means "in series" and if you want to series the relays then you
need better contacts and coil sizing becomes more critical. Remember, the coil runs
off of conventional current and then produces the back-spike. Conventional current
(amps & volts) are roughly 1/2 at the same voltage output. What you likely want to
try is a parallel hookup of multiple coils or relays... I had a great pic of a 3 coiler
IRO on that Practical Guide to Free Energy devices link, not sure exactly where tho...
If memory serves, it was 2 IRO coils series connected off of 1 NC contact, and then
it had a larger (car?) coil in parallel with that, and it was a 24V source. Feeding
multiple charge batteries. That would likely fit your needs and more. [b]


And if you could do that would this setup not basically provide an unlimited source of energy?
[b]IT IS Theoretically possible. Slightly impractical, as batteries do not really store all
that much energy as compared to a normal household usage, but it is possible.
That means you need LOTS of BIG batteries.


Thank you all so much :)


I'll be posting more diagrams as I get a digi-cam and some stuff scanned.

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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2009 9:11 pm 
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PS: I have not seen any "device" (you asked about a small DC motor) that uses
Radiant Energy directly. Only batteries and capacitors can convert RE to CC
(conventional current). In a battery, it also takes a while to convert totally,
that is why JB recommends waiting 24 hours before using the batt's, and he also
recommends using an inverter for better conversion efficiency. But you intend to use one.
Get a larger inverter if you can, but 350W is a good starting point if you already have it.

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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 12:50 am 
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Radiant energy is very good at powering fluorescent tubes.

I have also read it is good for inductive loads (hope i didn't misread it), i put it in a second ignition coil to see if i could multiply the radiant energy, something like Tesla's magnifying transmitter. I could not detect an increase in the radiant but there was a magnetic field so I would think it is possible to power a motor. Sorry to disagree Rob.

Having said that I must say the results i got, could have been the result of the transformer effect of my coils.

It is not good with semiconductors, it tends to burn them out


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 Post subject: Re: Hello All!!
PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:38 am 
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mbrownn wrote:
Radiant energy is very good at powering fluorescent tubes.
:oops: Forgot that one!

I have also read it is good for inductive loads (hope i didn't misread it), i put it in a second ignition coil to see if i could multiply the radiant energy, something like Tesla's magnifying transmitter. I could not detect an increase in the radiant but there was a magnetic field so I would think it is possible to power a motor. Sorry to disagree Rob.
Not at all! I'm here to learn too, just cuz I'm somewhat familiar with conventional
current does not automatically make me a free energy guru :lol: In fact, RE
being useful with coils as well as cap's makes sense, they both skew the current and
voltage out-of-phase with each other. Glad for the additional Info MICK!


Having said that I must say the results i got, could have been the result of the transformer effect of my coils.
Possibly, but the .pdf pics and files in that link I listed (hard to show here)
show coils used in the way you describe. I'll see if I can save that file down to
my desktop and get a photo file of that pic.


It is not good with semiconductors, it tends to burn them out

Perhaps the FE folks need to scale up more! I have read that the neon is not really a
good outlet for the transistor, it is more of a warning light than a safety device. In
other words, when it lights, you need to get a load on there FAST.


OK, so what have we learned, RE is good for direct use of the following items:
1. Neon Lighting
2. Fluorescent Lighting
3. Capacitors
4. Coils (inductors) and possibly by extension of the magnetic forces,
5. Motors?

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